Topic: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim (Read 1113 times)

Copernicus · « **on:** February 27, 2008, 02:16:45 PM »

Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Back in the 60's, I was a member of the Ohio State judo team. I was not a very good player, but I used to love the idea of the "Gentle Way", which required one to analyze and use the opponent's aggression to defeat him. During free practice (randori), we attempted to push, drag, and pull the other player, trying to find an angle of attack. One of my favorite senseis was Mr. Kim, a former member of South Korea's Olympics judo team and a sandan (3rd degree black belt). He never moved around. He just stood there and let others push and pull at him, which might make him move a couple of steps. Trying to attack him was like trying to pull down a brick wall. He would just wait, or mirror your steps like a graceful dance partner. And then it would be over. He saw his opening, waited for an attack, and performed a coup de grace in the blink of an eye. His opponent would crash down with the boom of his arm beat hitting the mat.

Watching the Cleveland debate last night between Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, I couldn't help but think of Obama as Mr. Kim. Most of the time, he sat there playing with his pen, writing the occasional note (or doodle) and appearing to listen attentively. Occasionally, he would hear something, smile a little, look at the moderator, and raise a finger. She felt he had not rejected the antisemite, Louis Farrakhan, forcefully enough? Fine. He conceded her point and used the word "reject". She mocked his inspirational style at a political rally? Great performance. He thought it was funny and effective. He wanted to bomb Pakistan without consulting its government? Not really. He just would act on actionable intelligence against Al Qaeda, which Bush had just done the week before. At the end of the debate, Obama lavished praise on her record and her candidacy, and then he went on to say why he thought his presidency would be better.

Of all the traits I admire in Obama's character, I admire the most his ability to empathize with an opponent and turn it to his advantage. He comes off as self-effacing, polite, and determined. He studies his opponents carefully, identifies a weak point in their movements, and throws them to the mat without much apparent effort. I don't suppose that he will always be the winner in his encounters with skillful opponents, but he understands the "gentle way" of fighting. He is the Mr. Kim of politics. I wonder how he will fare against Vladimir Putin, who is an avid judo player.

http://naastika.blogspot.com/2008/02/hillary-clinton-meets-mr-kim.html

David · « **Reply #1 on:** February 27, 2008, 09:40:17 PM »

Judo sounds sweet. I've been pondering which martial art to take and I was leaning toward karate, but this Judo sounds good.
So you use your opponents momentum against them?

Copernicus · « **Reply #2 on:** February 28, 2008, 02:28:05 AM »

Quote from: David on February 27, 2008, 09:40:17 PM

Judo sounds sweet. I've been pondering which martial art to take and I was leaning toward karate, but this Judo sounds good.
So you use your opponents momentum against them?

Among other things. Judo also uses chokes and arm bars. Russian Sambo (Putin's sport) is very much like judo, but it has a few different rules. For example, Sambo allows you to use arm bars as part of a throw, whereas judo is more restrictive. You can only use an arm bar to immobilize an opponent in judo. Sambo combines elements of judo and aikido. Karate has more action and is flashier to watch. The problem with it is that you can't really hit anyone. Judo is more of a contact sport.

David · « **Reply #3 on:** February 28, 2008, 05:58:31 PM »

"Among other things. Judo also uses chokes and arm bars. Russian Sambo (Putin's sport) is very much like judo, but it has a few different rules. For example, Sambo allows you to use arm bars as part of a throw, whereas judo is more restrictive. You can only use an arm bar to immobilize an opponent in judo. Sambo combines elements of judo and aikido. Karate has more action and is flashier to watch. The problem with it is that you can't really hit anyone. Judo is more of a contact sport. "

Hmm...which one do you think is better as far as immobilizing an opponent with out doing serious long term damage? Is there and American type of fighting similiar to these oriental ones? In the comment about karate did you mean that it is impractical?

Copernicus · « **Reply #4 on:** February 28, 2008, 11:23:36 PM »

Quote from: David on February 28, 2008, 05:58:31 PM

Hmm...which one do you think is better as far as immobilizing an opponent with out doing serious long term damage? Is there and American type of fighting similiar to these oriental ones? In the comment about karate did you mean that it is impractical?

Aikido teaches the greatest number of techniques for immobilizing opponents, although you learn a lot of arm bars and chokes in judo. The problem we (judo players) had with karate was that you really couldn't ever use it without holding back. It wasn't a very satisfying sport. Judo is more like wrestling, so you could really let yourself go. If you like wrestling, you'll like judo.

David · « **Reply #5 on:** February 28, 2008, 11:40:16 PM »

Where is aikido from? I estimate karate is mostly kicks and punches, eh? Is there an American type of martial arts? What does Chuck Norris do? lol, Thanks for anwering my questions, sensei.

Copernicus · « **Reply #6 on:** February 29, 2008, 02:30:59 AM »

Quote from: David on February 28, 2008, 11:40:16 PM

Where is aikido from? I estimate karate is mostly kicks and punches, eh? Is there an American type of martial arts? What does Chuck Norris do? lol, Thanks for anwering my questions, sensei.

Aikido is Japanese. "Karate" means "open hand", and it is mostly kicks and punches. Japanese Bushido is primarily kicks. Kung Fu is a very acrobatic style of Chinese fighting that is similar to Karate. Chuck Norris was best known for his Karate.

Anthony Horvath · « **Reply #7 on:** February 29, 2008, 07:56:53 AM »

"Judo is more like wrestling, so you could really let yourself go. If you like wrestling, you'll like judo."

Yea, I was going to say that immobilizing is a huge part of wrestling.

I should have known you were judo or 'gentle-way' guy, Cop. I got out of Tae kwon do because it was too gentle. I ended up in wrestling which was literally the only place that I could find where you could 'really let yourself go.'

My parents stuck with TKD for a time. Now they run a martial arts studio (kenpo, some other stuff). The debate between what is better suited for a brawl has never ended. Granted, in wrestling all of the really cool stuff is the illegal stuff, and if you practice only the legal stuff you burn that into your muscle memory which could be a liability in a tussle, you also get a really honest feel for how the human body can bend... and not bend.

I think the ultimate fighter series is almost always won by wrestlers and I think that tells the truest tale. :)

One of the coolest things I've even seen, though, was on Discovery channel's ... some show about evaluating the claims of martial artist's strengths and such... they were measuring the striking power of various trained men and comparing it to what would happen in a car crash at say, 30 or 40 mph. All of the martial artists proved that they could do that kind of damage. But the ninja, oh yes, the panzy looking hippy ninja... he blew them all away with some massive number.

I've always wanted to be a ninja.

David · « **Reply #8 on:** February 29, 2008, 01:12:56 PM »

I am a ninja.

lol j/k. So where would you go to become a ninja? Japan? Are there ninja training centers here?

And yeah, thats true about the uf series, but theres a few reasons I don't like wrestling:

1. One has to wear tight spandex jumpsuits. Just not as cool as one of those white ninja robe things with the neat belts.

2. Too much body contact hugging business going on. The possibility of a groin-face combo is not cool. Just not cool.

3. No sweet jump kicks or roundhouse kicks or hurricane kicks or other such bad a%#ery.

4. Its not what Chuck Norris does.

Copernicus · « **Reply #9 on:** February 29, 2008, 02:15:53 PM »

I confess that I, too, fantasized about winning fights with martial arts skills when I was young. A high level of testosterone can do that to you, but it doesn't necessarily make you a good fighter. Here is the advice that our judo master, a third degree Kodokan black belt, advised us regarding self defense. If you are ever accosted by an assailant with a gun, do what he says. Do not attempt to outrun the bullet or catch it in mid-air. If you are confronted by someone with a knife or a club, run away as fast as you can. If somebody insults you and makes you feel that you need to defend your honor, don't. Your well-being is more important than your honor. In other words, avoid getting into fights. Run away if you can.

Now, George understood what we wanted. We were young, and he was still a fairly young man (although we practiced with a couple of sho-dans in their 50s, who were very good). Finally, one night, someone came after him with a mock knife to try to corner him. He just began backing away with a big cheshire-cat grin on his face and showed us how he would use Bushido--not Judo--in such a situation. But we also learned that his Bushido career was cut short by a broken arm in a match, which had never healed properly. So he lectured us on not thinking that we could get into fights and use our martial arts skills to prevail. He didn't think that there was any "best" technique for self-defense. Any technique would work, including plain old wrestling. The winner was not he who applied the best technique, but he who applied a technique first. Martial arts will not teach you to prevail in street fights. Practice at fighting in the streets will, and the people who seek out such fights are just participating in the time-honored process of evolution. Gradually, they help to remove their genes from the gene pool.

David · « **Reply #10 on:** February 29, 2008, 07:52:52 PM »

"I confess that I, too, fantasized about winning fights with martial arts skills when I was young. A high level of testosterone can do that to you, but it doesn't necessarily make you a good fighter."

Oh, I will be a great fighter and win brawls with martial arts.

"Here is the advice that our judo master, a third degree Kodokan black belt, advised us regarding self defense."

Well, I hold him in the highest regard as an athlete and a fighter, but the philosophy of fighting is another matter.

"In other words, avoid getting into fights."

I totally agree.

"Run away if you can."

Never retreat, Never surrender.

"Martial arts will not teach you to prevail in street fights."

How could it not? How could training and learing how to fight for countless hours not make you better at fighting? How could Bruce Lee and Chuck Norris and Jackie Chan not win 99% of the barfights in the world?

Anthony Horvath · « **Reply #11 on:** February 29, 2008, 08:39:21 PM »

1. One has to wear tight spandex jumpsuits. Just not as cool as one of those white ninja robe things with the neat belts.

Fair enough, but you get your wrist wrapped in loose fitting clothes once in the middle of a jap whizzer and you'll re-think the value of those tight clothes. Also, loose clothes can suffocate ya pretty good if someone is trying to pin you, which is already a pretty restrictive situation.

Oh yea, and there is an offset with the ladies, too.

The spandex don't hide nothing.

I'm talking about the bulging arm and leg muscles, you sickoh. What were you thinking?

2. Too much body contact hugging business going on. The possibility of a groin-face combo is not cool. Just not cool.

Yea, I can feel that. (maybe not the best way to express sympathy in this example). I also never thought I'd be in a situation where in they would say, "Now, the next step is to reach across and grab his big, right, buttock..." Truthfully, though, when you're in the middle of combat you don't think about such things.

3. No sweet jump kicks or roundhouse kicks or hurricane kicks or other such bad a%#ery.

4. Its not what Chuck Norris does. Cool

I can't dispute either of those two points. I will say that wrestling is as good as living chess. If you approach it the right way, the mental side of it is as enjoyable as the physical side. And approaching it the right way means doing the things that will help you win- which is to say, embracing the mental side. It isn't cat and mouse, its multi-layered, leveled, chess.

Anthony Horvath · « **Reply #12 on:** February 29, 2008, 08:46:42 PM »

Cop-

My martial artist folks would generally agree about the street fighting bit, except my step dad was a street fighter, so they've integrated. :)

Quote

If you are ever accosted by an assailant with a gun, do what he says. Do not attempt to outrun the bullet or catch it in mid-air. If you are confronted by someone with a knife or a club, run away as fast as you can. If somebody insults you and makes you feel that you need to defend your honor, don't. Your well-being is more important than your honor. In other words, avoid getting into fights. Run away if you can.

Usually, but not always. If you are accosted by a guy with a gun, and he says get in the car, you do not get in the car. Your odds of never being seen alive when you are consequently transported are extremely high. In an abduction scenario, fighting and possibly dying on the scene is much better odds. Also in an abduction scenario, the 'mark' is usually the one the baddies think they can get in the car in the first place. they'll move on to a different target if you make a lot of noise. Also in that scenario, running and zigging and zagging makes you a hard target if they do decide to retaliate.

I generally agree about whether or not you should defend your honor. In general, I have always found a way to get away. However, when it is someone else's honor at stake, it might be a different matter.

And sometimes you just gotta pop the bully in the nose. In one case in point, the bully got the best of me but because I didn't back down he never messed with me again. In fact, he came to respect me.

The situation needs to be taken in stride. Naturally, the guy on the street who is a bully is a slightly differnet case. So too is the guy on the street who doesn't want to take your wallet but uses the taking of the wallet as a pretense for having sport with you. Gotta be thinking it might be either at any time.

Author Topic: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim (Read 1113 times)

Copernicus

The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

David

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Copernicus

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

David

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Copernicus

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

David

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Copernicus

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Anthony Horvath

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

David

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Copernicus

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

David

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Anthony Horvath

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim

Anthony Horvath

Re: The Mighty Cop: Hillary Clinton Meets Mr. Kim