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nojc4me

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Paganism
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2005, 08:50:42 PM »
jesusboy,

As for the judeo Christian thing my Dad a former pastor said it is because it came out of the jewish faith Jesus was jewish as well as the ten commandments.

The jesus myth did not come out of the Jewish faith; it's Mithraism.
Jesus was Jewish only because the authors who made him up decided he should be.
The 10 Commandments are Jewish, yes. But that has nothing to do with the n.t. The authors who made up the stories took the Judaism (which he little understood) from that time period and used it as a backdrop for his "retelling" of the Mithra myth.
It has been correctly said:

"What is good in the New Testament, is not new.
What is new in the New Testament, is no Earthly good."

Most of the new teachings to be found in the new testament are not only not good, they actually run AGAINST the Word of God. For examples:
"Turn the other cheek" is evil. God tells us to root out evil and eradicate it.
"Think not that I am come to bring peace... but the sword." Yet the REAL messiah sets up a kingdom of peace - UNIVERSAL peace!
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." God's Laws demanded certain sinners be stoned, while jesus' words seek to keep them from meeting this doom.
"Bring those who would not have me rule over them here and kill them before my face." Jesus advocates mercilessness and vindictiveness.
Every sentence which speaks of "the Devil" is there simply to strengthen fear of "the Devil." This means the nt writers supported and promoted belief in a false god.
The verses that indicate that there is no forgiveness of sin EXCEPT through the dead god/man, jesus, all those verses weaken and contradict God's Word, because He never said you need jesus for forgiveness of sins. Far from "One Way Only," God tells us there are MANY ways to obtain forgiveness of sins.
The notion of jesus' death as being a suitable sacrifice to God denies His prohibition of human sacrifice.
The notion that jesus fulfilled the messianic prophecies denies the validity of those very prophecies. If he had really been the messiah, we would be living in the messianic era, but we're not, so he wasn't.
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Suggested Reading list:
"You Take jesus, I'll Take God" - Sam Levine
"The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" - Robert Heinlein
"Hope" - Aaron Zelman & L. Neil Smith
"The Probability Broach" - L. Neil Smith
"Wizard's First Rule" - Terry Goodkind (Check out the rest of the series, too.)
"The Constitution of the United States" - input from various American Statesmen (Read that as "Old, wealthy white men, now dead, who were often seen to be wearing wigs and hose in public.")

TheAtheistHeratic

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Paganism
« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2005, 08:24:35 AM »
i found the definition at dictionary.com
One who is not a Christian, Muslim, or Jew, especially a worshiper of a polytheistic religion.
One who has no religion.
A non-Christian.
A hedonist.
A Neo-Pagan
a person who does not acknowledge your God
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"Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it you would have good people doing good things and evil people doing evil things. But for good people to do evil things, that takes religion." (Washington, D.C., April 1999) [2]

"One of the great achievements of science has been, if not to make it impossible for intelligent people to be religious, then at least to make it possible for them not to be religious. We should not retreat from this accomplishment." (ibid.)
[edit]

Both quotes of Steven Weinberg

KalikaScott

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Paganism
« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2005, 01:51:53 PM »
And that happens to be the definition of what word exactly?
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And it harm none, do what ye will.
The Bible summed up into one sentence.

Tony N

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Paganism
« Reply #23 on: July 13, 2005, 07:51:12 AM »
njc,
Actually the teachings of Christ fulfill all the law. Love is the complement of the law.

Love your associate as yourself.
Love God.

If the law was really given to make people righteous without Christ, it failed miserably. The law was given to lead Israel to Christ, not make them independent of Christ.

I realize you don't believe any of this but that's not my problem.

If the law was given to really make people righteous, then why did all the law and prophets speak about Christ coming to die for the sins of all?
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Did God say that He "will have all mankind to be saved" or that He "will NOT have all mankind to be saved? (1Tim.2:4-6]
Did God say He IS the Saviour of all mankind, or that He "is NOT the Saviour of all mankind? (1Tim.4:10)

Well?
Are we told to "charge and teach these things" or are we told "NOT to charge and teach these things"? (1Tim.4:10,11).

Well? Are we?

nojc4me

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Paganism
« Reply #24 on: July 13, 2005, 07:34:30 PM »
Tony N said:

njc,
Actually the teachings of Christ fulfill all the law. Love is the complement of the law.

Actuually, no, it didn't. Youu can't "fulfill" a law. You can fulfill a prophecy, but not a law.
Laws are meant to be followed, to be obeyed, not to be "fulfilled."

Love your associate as yourself.
Love God.

If the law was really given to make people righteous without Christ, it failed miserably.

That, according to the Bible, is incorrect. Scripture names several righteous people, including Noah, the fellow who built an ark, which is a big sort of boat. Interesting story. It's found in a book they call, "The Bible." It's a good read. You should look into it some day.

The law was given to lead Israel to Christ, not make them independent of Christ.

Which "christ"? There were several. Starting with the person who originated the title, "Krishna." You're suggesting that God led people to Krishna, or "christ", or "Mithra", or whatever you're calling him this century? Have any evidence of this alleged "leading people to christ" claim of yours. Cause the claim is hardly original, and I have repeatedly demanded such evidence, and nobody has provided any yet.

I realize you don't believe any of this but that's not my problem.

It's not going to be accepted because it's not true. The lack of truth in your claim is not my problem.

If the law was given to really make people righteous, then why did all the law and prophets speak about Christ coming to die for the sins of all?

They didn't. Never happened. They said nothing of the sort. None of them, not once. In fact, at least two said that the exact opposite was the truth: Nobody dies for the sins of another.
Those two were two of the best known prophets, too, Moses and Ezekiel.
If you knew anything about the Bible, you might have remembered that before you rashly and foolishly made those false claims. And in public, where they can be proven unfounded, as well!
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Suggested Reading list:
"You Take jesus, I'll Take God" - Sam Levine
"The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress" - Robert Heinlein
"Hope" - Aaron Zelman & L. Neil Smith
"The Probability Broach" - L. Neil Smith
"Wizard's First Rule" - Terry Goodkind (Check out the rest of the series, too.)
"The Constitution of the United States" - input from various American Statesmen (Read that as "Old, wealthy white men, now dead, who were often seen to be wearing wigs and hose in public.")

Tony N

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Paganism
« Reply #25 on: July 14, 2005, 10:58:43 AM »
Dear njc,
Your post reminds me of one who never studies the bible but just relies on others to do it for them.

Beginning with Gen.3:15 I suggest you work your way through the Bible concerning the Messiah Who was to come to save us:

Gen 3:15 And enmity am I setting between you and the woman, and between your seed and her seed. He shall hurt your head and you shall hurt his heel.
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Did God say that He "will have all mankind to be saved" or that He "will NOT have all mankind to be saved? (1Tim.2:4-6]
Did God say He IS the Saviour of all mankind, or that He "is NOT the Saviour of all mankind? (1Tim.4:10)

Well?
Are we told to "charge and teach these things" or are we told "NOT to charge and teach these things"? (1Tim.4:10,11).

Well? Are we?

Gol Akaron

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Paganism
« Reply #26 on: July 14, 2005, 11:10:34 AM »
"Krishna?" Where does that come from? Last I heard, "Christ" is simply the Greek word christos--"anointed one."
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Zagzagel

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Paganism
« Reply #27 on: July 14, 2005, 10:05:26 PM »
Interesting question.  Perhaps, this is why Moses said that God will raise up someone LIKE HIM.  Now what about that word "LIKE" eh?  Like in which way, I wonder?  Now there has been many who have been raised up as the messiah or such like for people to follow.  I want to follow this LIKE ONE that Moses spoke of...and I think, so far, that this is the Jesus of the bible.  People such as Nojc4me don't really know.  They can give reasons and answeres for the "like one", but this is yet future to them.  Oh well...perhaps we all die before this "like one" comes according to noj4me?
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Cheers.  :)  Be well.  Live better!

Tomtheironmongoose

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Re: Paganism
« Reply #28 on: July 02, 2007, 04:58:52 PM »
To those honestly concerned and Christians who actually are interested in understanding; Neo-Pagan is an umbrella term. Wiccans, Neo-Druids, Neo-Celts, Asatruars, Neo-Hellenic, and Mithrists all fall under this umbrella. The Wiccan Rede and Three-fold Law are typically accepted or at least respected by the groups since they are the most known ethical codes.

To the non-Christians trying to be jerks, please stop it. You are embarassing yourself. Christianity, for whatever similarities that appear, is not and never has been Pagan, and anyone who makes the claim has no understanding of history or theology.
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Righteous Goy

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Re: Paganism
« Reply #29 on: July 04, 2007, 01:29:33 PM »
Tony suggested,

Dear njc,
Your post reminds me of one who never studies the bible but just relies on others to do it for them.

Beginning with Gen.3:15 I suggest you work your way through the Bible concerning the Messiah Who was to come to save us:

Gen 3:15 And enmity am I setting between you and the woman, and between your seed and her seed. He shall hurt your head and you shall hurt his heel.

That doesn't say anythiong about a or the messiah.
It could apply to all mankind, and no one man or woman more than any other.
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Mankind cannot rise to the essential principles on which society must rest unless it meets with Israel. And Israel cannot fathom the depths of its own Tradition unless it meets with mankind.
(Rabbi Elijah Benamozegh, 1823-1901)

"Violence in self-defense is absolutely justifiable." Irv Rubin interview, Los Angeles Times, November 9, 1995

Let me strive every moment of my life, to make myself better and better, to the best of my ability, that all may profit by it.
Let me think of the right and lend all my assistance to those who need it, with no regard for anything but justice.
Let me take what comes with a smile, without loss of courage.
Let me be considerate of my country, of my fellow citizens and my associates in everything I say and do.
Let me do right to all, and wrong no man.
--- Doc Savage's Oath

jesusboy

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Re: Paganism
« Reply #30 on: July 07, 2007, 08:24:35 PM »
To mongosse dude amen. Hey every one jesusboy is back I would post more but with college done for the year and coming up again soon  i am home working my tail off to pay tuition pretty busy.  Paganism comes from ancient mythologies of the kelts and other civilizations. People of that time could not explain the strange events that happened so they came up with an expalanation. They did not know any better. What confuses me is as many people in the pagan society start worshiping all these nature things and expect that to so something for them they did nothing for the people then why would they do anything now.  Heck how do you know there even listening? kind of a one sided thing huh. later
if I dont post again for a while its because I am really busy I will try to find some spare time to post when i can
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