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Dannyboy

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Unspeakable
« on: October 02, 2008, 10:30:46 AM »

i watched some clips of the McCain/Obama debate, and found myself more interested in what they didn't (or couldn't?) say than what they did.  For instance, nuclear Iran.  Obama says that we must avoid an arms race in the middle east, and that to do this we should stop Iran from acquiring nuclear weapons.  McCain said essentially the same thing only a little more aggressively and a lot less coherently.

Hello?  Isn't the best way to stop an arms race in the middle east to address the issue of the individual who already started running?  Both candidates are clearly hampered from mentioning this by their mandatory declarations of support for Israel (which along with proclaimations of religious faith - Christian, obviously - seem to be a fundamental requirement to run for high office in the US.  From reading his books i doubt Obama is much more religious than i am).  Seriously, is it impossible to address the question of what might make Iran want to acquire nuclear weapons?

Here's a learning point:  The president of a very powerful country declares three countries to be part of an 'Axis of Evil'.  One of these countries has nuclear weapons, and the other two don't.  One of the non-nuclear countries then watches its erstwhile non-nuclear 'friend' (actually mortal enemy, but dont let the facts distract you from a really strong catchphrase) get invaded, its government overthrown, upwards of a million of its citizens killed in the resultant chaos which descends into civil war.  Meanwhile its nuclear 'friend' is treated to diplomatic engagement and aid agreements.  What is the government of this country likely to make their number one priority?

Even if this was not the case, the nuclear arms race in the middle east has already started when Israel acquired the bomb.  Does Israel really need nuclear weapons, since it already has the strongest army in the region?  Could there not be some discussion about the possibility of Israel phasing out its nukes?  Not on a presidential debate apparently.

Is it out of the bounds of possibility that our leaders and potential leaders could talk to us like adults?  Iran may be involving itself in Iraq, funding the insurgency.  Maybe, but why have i yet to hear any politician anywhere say something along the lines of "Well duh, of course they are - how do you think the US would react if a hostile power was occupying Mexico?".  Something above the level of the prevailing comic book good-vs-evil analysis would be nice.

 :smt076 [/rant]
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Anthony Horvath

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2008, 10:36:17 AM »

Been reading a bit too much Huffington and CommonDreams unless I'm mistaken.  ;)
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Dannyboy

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2008, 10:42:47 AM »

Is that all you've got?  Mr i-dont-have-time-to-respond-to-Dannyboy-but-if-someone-critiques-Palin-i'll-be-all-over-it.

i do read common dreams from time to time.  What's Huffington?

And also, do you have a comment to make or did you just slide by to rag me about my political influences?  Because other people can play that game.

 :smt019
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Anthony Horvath

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2008, 10:49:12 AM »

heh the blog is what puts the bread on the table.  ;)

You don't know about the Huffington Post?  It is always good for some chuckles.

No, I didn't have any comments to make.  I figured why start another fire when I haven't even yet responded to your other post... but I see now that I can win for losing.  ;)
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Anthony Horvath

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #4 on: October 02, 2008, 10:50:02 AM »

Oh, I have one incidental question- have you ever seen me spout off on Israel?
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Dannyboy

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #5 on: October 02, 2008, 02:11:29 PM »

heh the blog is what puts the bread on the table.

Really?  People pay you for that stuff?   [smile

i will check out the huffington post on your recommendation.  Who doesn't like chuckles?

Oh, I have one incidental question- have you ever seen me spout off on Israel?

Not as such.  You tend to abdicate any comment on the subject with the non-sequitur that there are plenty of worse things going on in the world, and observations about the liberal left's obsession with critiquing Israel.  i dont completely disagree - i certainly think that there is a dearth of criticism of the US's oldest ally in the Gulf (SA), perhaps because from the commentary of US officials you wouldn't know that there was any relationship at all.  But i do think it is reasonable to hold democracies to a higher standard than non-democracies.  What do you say, Mr i-can-apparently-win-by-losing?
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Anthony Horvath

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #6 on: October 02, 2008, 03:42:08 PM »

"Really?  People pay you for that stuff?"

heh no, but the blog is what generates the traffic.  More entries=more traffic.  More traffic=more of everything else. 

"Not as such.  You tend to abdicate any comment on the subject"

lol give me one example.  I don't believe you.

 with the non-sequitur that there are plenty of worse things going on in the world, and observations about the liberal left's obsession with critiquing Israel.  i dont completely disagree

So not exactly a non-sequitur then?  Or it still is?  Or, its only a non-sequitur at the point you begin to disagree with me.  :)

"What do you say, Mr i-can-apparently-win-by-losing?"

About what?  Saudia Arabia or Israel?
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Dannyboy

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #7 on: October 08, 2008, 08:11:16 AM »

"Not as such.  You tend to abdicate any comment on the subject"

lol give me one example.  I don't believe you.


You are abdicating comment right now.  Will that do as an example?

"What do you say, Mr i-can-apparently-win-by-losing?"

About what?  Saudia Arabia or Israel?


Address the OP, or don't - it's your decision.

My wife sends her regards to your wife.  Not to you though (i blocked those regards because you're not addressing the OP).   [smile
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If God has a problem with the way i live my life then let him tell me, not you.

"Denying your own experience of reality is never a good step, no matter how many are arrayed against you" - Spero by AR Horvath

W. E. Messamore

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Re: Unspeakable
« Reply #8 on: October 12, 2008, 09:30:27 PM »

I share your frustration with the debates.  The truth is, if either of these candidates were really serious about addressing issue straightforwardly and fighting ignorance rather than perpetuating it, then it wouldn't have been them at the debates anyways.  Says a lot about the USA.

As for our foreign policy... yeah, totally schizoid- or at best, just not rational at all.  I think it might have something to do with post-moderns being incapable of understanding that effects have causes.
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