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Copernicus

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The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« on: March 23, 2009, 11:24:07 PM »

Here is an interesting article that was published in the Christian Science Monitor:  The Coming Evangelical Collapse.  Just to whet your appetite:

Quote
We are on the verge
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Dannyboy

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Re: The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2009, 01:17:07 PM »

Hi Cop,

i'm skeptical.  In the fifties and sixties there were plenty of people predicting that religion globally was on the decline and would play little more part in world affairs.  What actually happened was that fundamentalisms in all major religions staged a come-back against what they perceived to be the blight of secularism.  i have no doubt that the pendulum will swing again, but i'm wary of anyone predicting the absolute 'end' of anything (think Fukayama in the early nineties, yet history apparently continues to be made). 

Karen Armstrong's book "The Battle for God" is quite good on this dynamic.

Bottom line - there are people out there convinced that evangelism is the way to save millions of souls, and i dont see them abandoning that idea easily.
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Copernicus

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Re: The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2009, 02:21:18 PM »

I agree that the case is overstated, DB, but I can't help but think that the author has a point about a sudden decline in 0ld-style Christian evangelism.  The problem, as I see it, is that the internet has irretrievably changed the way we get our information.  Anyone who has the slightest interest now can meet with and debate the most passionate defenders of atheism, not to mention other philosophical and religious points of view.  All the arguments are out there and exposed now.  That is a radical change from the 50s and 60s, when the public perception of atheism was limited to figures such as Einstein (not an overt atheist, but debating Bishop Sheen, the first televangelist) and Madlyn Murray O'Hair. 

I do not think that the association of evangelists with the failed conservative movement is quite the blow that the author does, but it is symptomatic of the problem.  Evangelical Christianity needs to reposition itself in order to survive.  The younger generation is just not receptive to the old way of thinking.  I suppose that sntjohnny agrees with this to some degree, although for different reasons.  He sees the boat as capsized, but he feels that  he has a recipe for setting it right.  In any case, we can probably all agree that religious conservatism and fundamentalism faces a big problem in the US in the near future.  Politically, they are in decline for now.
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End Bringer

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Re: The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2009, 03:21:48 PM »

I do not think that the association of evangelists with the failed conservative movement is quite the blow that the author does, but it is symptomatic of the problem.  Evangelical Christianity needs to reposition itself in order to survive.  The younger generation is just not receptive to the old way of thinking.  I suppose that sntjohnny agrees with this to some degree, although for different reasons.  He sees the boat as capsized, but he feels that  he has a recipe for setting it right.  In any case, we can probably all agree that religious conservatism and fundamentalism faces a big problem in the US in the near future.  Politically, they are in decline for now.

And hopefully this will go a long way to not only help convert people to Christianity but to awaken current Christians from their self-induced lathargy. As not only has conversion been historically high when faced with persecution, but seeing the horrible end result of secularism as a reality first hand rather than an abstraction (at least in America) also helps in persuading people. So I wouldn't mind the end of Evangilism (at least in it's current form), if it means being able to bring more people to Christianity and educate Christians.
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Zagzagel

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Re: The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2009, 04:39:00 PM »

Hmm.. somehow religion.. no matter how put or defined.. will always be there.  Something that Cannot be eradicated. 

I don't see or predict a collapse at all within the Evengelical views.  Once they become more aware of their surroundings and the Athiestic views, perhaps, maybe.. they will then become a mouthpiece more stronger?  That is what I see as knowledge becomes more available.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2009, 04:41:59 PM by Zagzagel »
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Anthony Horvath

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Re: The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2009, 07:04:52 PM »

Quote
Bottom line - there are people out there convinced that evangelism is the way to save millions of souls, and i dont see them abandoning that idea easily.

It is important that we clarify that 'Evangelical' is distinct from evangelism.   There will not be a collapse in evangelism.  :)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evangelicalism

The wiki does a reasonable job surveying the concept.  Evangelism, on the other hand, is about trying to bring people to a saving relationship with Jesus.

The Internet Monk has been making the same kinds of observations that I have been making for some time.  The role of the Internet in all this is crucial, imo.  Yes, Cop and I have different rationales for our views.

Rather than recapitulate all that I think on the matter I direct folks to my posts on the ChristianPost.com and on my own blog.

On the CP these posts will cover it:
http://christianpost.com/blogs/christianity/2009/01/we-do-not-have-a-right-to-a-christian-culture-13/index.html
http://christianpost.com/blogs/christianity/2009/01/radical-love-will-revive-a-radical-christianity-15/index.html
http://christianpost.com/blogs/christianity/2009/01/transforming-society-from-inside-out-christian-calls-to-return-to-an-acts-community-26/index.html

On my blog, this post explicitly mentions the referenced article and indirectly responds to it:
http://sntjohnny.com/front/the-forgotten-doctrine-love/467.html

This one discusses 'religion in decline' and a commenter throws in the Spencer article:

http://sntjohnny.com/front/study-religion-in-decline.-what-do-we-do-about-it/465.html

And here is a virtual presentation of my topic:  "The Death of Christianity:  Can Christianity Survive the Internet."
http://sntjohnny.com/front/online-presentation-on-the-demise-of-christianity/453.html

Enjoy.

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Copernicus

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Re: The Coming Evangelical Collapse
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2009, 07:35:06 PM »

Good point, sntjohnny.  It is also true that evangelicals are not all 'fundamentalists' in the popular parlance.  I know that this is a hot button topic of yours.  There is a serious demographic trend towards secularism in American youth.  We can disagree about the causes, but it is real.  For me, it seems a logical outcome of the information age.  For you, it seems a failure of the way traditional religious establishments promote their faith.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2009, 07:37:08 PM by Copernicus »
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